Any opinions on placing as much weight as possible over the axles, rather than large weights in the center of a car? I have heard that this allows the floorboard to spring more, but am asking for other opinions. Obviously for some smaller drivers this may not be an option, but when a driver is large enough that the center weight could be greatly reduced or eliminated, is this really an improvement?

any thoughts???

my daugters car seems faster when its tail heavy and with weight in the middle
but I could be full of it
I 'm chasing a rabbit the same way you are

Get as much weight as possible into the center of the car. Only put enough weight on the ends to achieve the tail weight that you need for a specific track. The bumpier the track, the more important this is.

Well, there's only about 10-15 pounds in my Super Stock car, and basically all of it is in the front in order to make 5-lbs tail weight. I haven't had center weight in my car for 3 years.

If I had a choice, I'd concentrate on getting the weight as low as possible, (especially when running off large ramps) which entails placing some of it in the middle.

The superstock car is a engineering nightmare. The driver sits behind the center line of the 2 axles causing the car to be tailheavy when driver is in car. In order to balance the car a lot of weight has to be put on the front bolt. In superstock its not about what is best but what works.
Derek

Note additional holes that allow both Super Stock center weights to move forward (if necessary).

I feel, it's finding that the car likes best to run.

There seems to be no same placement theory from one car to another.

Keep it low, keep is centered and keep it tight.

sporty

Usually, the larger weight plates in the center of the car help stiffen the floorboard (when bolted down tightly).

I have to disagree with you Sporty. A car is not capable of telling you what it likes best. Basic physics do not change.

It is true that larger steel plates will stiffen the floor but if the plates or the receiving floorboard are not perfectly parallel, then when tightening the two together, you can introduce crossbind into your car.

So Sporty it is possible to believe that a car might not run as well with big plates in the middle, but you might have created cross bind, killing the car. But the connection might not be that obvious.

Jerry,

What I was trying to convey. Which I may have or may not have done so well, with a limited reply.


In our expierence, and through many questions and discussions with other racers and families. Now Naturally my overall view transcends to only three years.


The view to me is in the wood (floorboard), the grains and density of the wood is going to play some factor of the set up. ( personally view it a much bigger factor than others)

So no same set of set up numbers are going to work on a different floorboard, unless they are very close to density and grain pattern and come from the same batch of lumber.

I would agree, it will get you started it the right direction.


Keep it low- Well the lower the weight, the lower the center of gravity, the better. The more gain on potential energy. The More of a chance to optimize that maximum potential Energy. Center of mass is also a factor, along with inertia.


Also, doing well in closely related fields, has also helped us in learning to set up better for stock class.

I have tried to use a wider range of idea's and thoughts from pinewood derby, cubmobile, and the grandness of others that who have taught us about stock class soap box derby.


In my limited testing, I found it takes about 8 pounds to change only about 1/2-1 inch of balance point. due to the pre-determined spots of weight placement and the tail weight limit or restriction implemented in the sport. Not with standing also the overall weight limit.

So, that made me view and think, that since a portion of the races we attend is only 5 pound tail weight. and how they are placed, may be some of a factor. It does limit weight placement and how that balance point is going to move from one car to the other.


In three years of racing for my son, we were slow and these past 6 months. We were finally able to get the groove on.and do much better and win his local. Against some very good well known racers.

Which we have alot of respect for !


I have seen cars win with poor alignment, well over .020. Naturally cross bind is a issue and a factor. but they still were winning.

however, the initial posting and topic was about weight, not all the other factors. So instead of trying to go off topic. I wanted to stay on coarse with what the person was initially asking.

I have seen stock class cars, run 102 tail versus 106 tail (against one another in a race) and they were both well seasoned racers with lots of seat time and good set up. I Also new neither car had crossbind.

The hill was steep, speed times were fast. the heavier tail car should have won, but it was the lighter car.

Even with talking about the road transition and so forth.

So I changed my view and tossed out some of the racer talk and what I had learned or was told from others and tried my own theories, which Are also noted and talked about in previous posts in this forum and other areas of the net.


So, I hope that even with you being in disagreement, you might perhaps view my conclusion as one not being out there ! but a fair and calculated response of analysis's.

Jerry, your history and great replies to alot of posts, carry much respect that I have for you and others.

So, I hope my reply appears professional, nice and with honor.


I feel you have to find what the car likes best, that floorboard is going to act or react different to the various settings and set ups that are done. The board, will let you know when you have hit the set up it likes. some boards are too stiff, not stiff enough, compression and tension are a factor in that. However, unless your humidity and temp in your area is the same also, thats gonna play a factor in how that floor board responds to the set up.

speed times are how a car can tell you what it likes, or what you want ! faster or slower. bigger gaps in time or less gaps in time from the other racer. from double to single race. or just a good old stop watch and a practice hill.

Well, i prefer not to go into steel, the axles, I have alot of questions and theories on that all by itself.

Might start a topic on that.


Sincerely,

Sporty

Sporty,

Great insite. Your work ethics will prove very fruitful for your children. I have no secrets and I will share knowledge with whomever asks because as I have stated many times.

"Gaining knowledge in Derby does not make you fast. It is the execution of that knowledge that makes the difference."

Many in modern derby people expect to ask alot of questions and then expect immediate success. This however is one sport that you for sure have to earn your stripes. And you seem to be on the right track. No pun intended.

Good luck on the BIG HILL. Look me up in Akron.

JJP

Sporty,

In your example of a 102# TW car beating a 106# TW car, did this happen to be at Rockford, Memorial day weekend?

Congrats on winning the local. We'll see you at Akron.

Clark's dad.

vinegarpie,


I sent you a PM for the reply to your question.


Sporty